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Post by Becky (Berkeleytravelers) on Mar 3, 2009 22:58:13 GMT -5
This seems so basic as to be silly, but - when does a modifier follow a noun or verb and when does it precede the noun or verb? I can't quite see what the pattern is, although I'm sure there is one (i.e., after nouns but before verbs, or whatever). Thanks in advance for any helpful guidelines!
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Post by Anne on Mar 4, 2009 4:55:08 GMT -5
A noun modifier usually precedes the noun, but there are many exceptions, like colour adjectives follow the noun : "un petit chien noir" . But then you also say "un chien adorable", so ... Verb modifiers follow the verb (always ?) It is very difficult for me to tell because I can only think of examples, these are not the kind of rules that one learns at school as a native speaker because the placing of the modifiers comes naturally to one's mind . Actually, someone who has studied French as a foreign language should be more qualified to tell you about rules .
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Post by Shoesy on Mar 4, 2009 5:35:56 GMT -5
I thought that most adjectives actually follow the noun. Then, of course, there are all those annoying exceptions, which always complicate matters. There is the acronym BAGS, which is supposed to generalize certain adjectives that precede the noun. B = beauty A = age G = goodness (or the opposite) S = size
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Post by GitteK on Mar 4, 2009 7:49:31 GMT -5
This is what I learnt too, shoesy (beau, vieux, grand, bon) - but when I look in e.g. the ladies' magazine I used to subscribe to, the journalists juggle the adjectives about totally unabashedly and place them whereever it makes the sentence/expression sound cool, hip and catchy........
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Post by Anne on Mar 4, 2009 8:17:40 GMT -5
Chouchou, your BAGS rule makes sense, but then "adorable" enters both the Beauty and Goodness categories, yet you cannot say "un adorable chien" ... unless you add another adjective, then you can say either "un adorable petit chien" or "un petit chien adorable" . Oh my, I'd better rush out of this thread or else I will get Becky even more confused than before she posted it !
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Post by Shoesy on Mar 4, 2009 9:04:21 GMT -5
Anne - The word "adorable" has 4 syllables. Can a 4-syllable adjective ever precede a noun?
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Post by luckyluc on Mar 4, 2009 9:42:54 GMT -5
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Post by Anne on Mar 5, 2009 9:13:14 GMT -5
Thank you Luc, this was desperately needed
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Post by cigalechanta on Mar 5, 2009 20:43:47 GMT -5
anne, are you the one who is the froggy lady? a great blog!
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Post by Anne on Mar 6, 2009 2:48:19 GMT -5
No cigale, this is anneparis . But her blog is great indeed, I check it on a regular basis and have already tried some of her receipes .
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